New Player vs Old Player Interactions

[Shadow I]

I get your point, I just don't agree with your interpretation, hence the grey area. You said that Arty started attacking someone else before you attacked him, so you did know he was doing stuff. What he did was not very polite, I suppose, but you should have messaged him before you attacked as well. Seems this is just misunderstanding on both sides. You set out to get a reaction, and you did. I'm just a little confused as to your own reaction to the situation.

Don't interpret this as defending Arthus at all, I am just pointing out that you are not exactly innocent either.

[windhound]

ah
gonna have to disagree Freen
If you see somone's online and you attack without 1) checking how many turns they have left or 2) sending a message inquiring if they're done with their land, then you share some of the blame there

Its like, to use your analogy, seeing a car coming but figuring you'll make it to the other side of the road before it gets there. This analogy assumes that neither the car nor the person has the right of way, ie, not a crosswalk

I mean, maybe he started his run then really had to use the toilet... maybe the phone rang... maybe someone was at the door... maybe someone im'd him and he got distracted.
If you're not sure someone's done its a nicety to inquire, especially if you /know/ they're online
Everyone I've messaged in this manner has either said "sure, I'm done" or "give me a few min, I'll let you know," with a "ok, done now" message following shortly thereafter

Now, if you espi and find they have 15 turns left its generally a safe bet they're done

[Shadow I]

Now, if you espi and find they have 15 turns left its generally a safe bet they're done

taking a crack at me?

if you are really mad about that catch me on msn sometime.

To take the analogy further, if you intentionally walk in front of a speeding car on the assumption that the driver will hit the brakes...

[windhound]

Hah, nah
I was never mad about it to begin with, mostly amused. Any ugly thing I might have said was to provoke a response, just to see what people say to those they dont know.

Thats actually what I did to LT Bear. I noticed he was online, but then the scores refreshed and he didnt come back for two min. I did an espi and found he had 15 turns left, figured he was done, and repayed him for his 17x unprovoked attacks (which he told me was a landgrab. sorry. 17x is too many, even for turbo... though I'm probably in the minority for thinking so)
He comes back online screaming bloody murder, how I was online attacking him, how he had been there the whole time et. all.
*shrug*
Oh. And I'm not so sure how well msn works... its always been a little flakey with pidgin, but feel free to catch me when you're on... I just did a clean install of CentOS 5.1, so mayhaps it cleared some things up... maybe.

[Shadow I]

I DLed AIM actually, kbriggs29

I rarely attack people without maxxing them, even here where the max is 31. Hell, other clanned people sometimes hit me 50+ times in one go. I don't mind anything other than onlining.

[Freenhult]

I didn't even know he started to run. Much less able to get an Espy. I think I did, I dont' remember. I didn't look at turns and that wouldn't matter because if it said 350, I could assume that he's not running. I had no way of knowing what so ever.

I don't see why I have to be like. "Get off please, I'm running". I could have, I guess, but still. The principal stands, that his run finished. Either prematurely or accidentally. I started my run and was attacked during it. I attacked someone who was online, but was running under false pretense.

I did nothing wrong short of not telling him to wait. Which, I doubt he would have.

[windhound]

Sorry.
I havnt played FAF actively in ages, so maybe a separate set of customs has sprung into being in my absence
What you're saying is that only one person may go at a time?
That if you login and see someone running, you should logout and come back later?
That if you get distracted by any number of reasons halfway through your run and the game marks you as inactive, you forfeit the remainder of your run?

Because that would be utterly foreign to me. I run in parallel with people all the time, I just dont attack the person running. If they happen to have scooped all the land and still appear breakable then I'll message "I can has land?" and go from there. Most of the time there are enough other targets I can safely avoid the other runner and still make a profitable run...

I mean, a message like "GTFO, I'm running" isnt what I said. I said message "are you done?"
The two are vastly different.

edit: Also, a newbie would be oblivious to such customs... acting as you did was not in character

[ohmyjapan16]

What you're saying is that only one person may go at a time?

It seems pretty straightforward that if one person is running, it would make sense not to disrupt them/start running because that way you split the land available, resulting in a less than par run for both.

That if you login and see someone running, you should logout and come back later?

Yeah, unless you want a less profitable run. (This is assuming you don't attack other players that are running)

That if you get distracted by any number of reasons halfway through your run and the game marks you as inactive, you forfeit the remainder of your run?

I think that it's understood that if you get distracted long enough to be marked offline, when someone else comes on, they're not at all at fault for attacking you, considering you were marked offline. Another understandable scenario is if you ask someone if they're done running and they don't respond for 5,10 minutes or more. Sometimes I have places to be and don't have that much time to wait for a response, so I could also see that as an understandable situation.


In my opinion, these so called customs do not take long to figure out, I would even go so far as to say they just seem common sense to me, as I have played by them and never really had a complaint and have been quite successful playing here as well as RWL, ME, heck even Valhall when there aren't people constantly camping.

Oh yeah and there are no customs in war, so when that takes place of course I don't play by those "customs." I do anything I can to damage the opposing side.

[Ruddertail]

You don't have to ask people to get off. Just, if they're on when when you start running, ask them if they're done. If they pop on while you're going, you can, just to be sure, but it's not really necessary...


Well... the problem is that if two people run parallel, they end up fighting over the land, as both people try to grab up all the land. Then, neither person can finish their run. As such, it's considered rather bad manners to start a run while somebody else is.

[Shadow I]

The "2nd" time was me running and Arty coming into my run, and attacking people

I didn't even know he started to run.

These statements appear contrdictory, which is why I am arguing it. The first indicates that you knew he was hitting people, and the second says the opposite. If the second means that you did not know he had started his run earlier and left and came back, but you knew he was attacking people at the time then you are just as in the wrong as he is, although the cause is more of a misunderstanding and poor timing than anything malicious on either part.

[Freenhult]

I knew he was AFTER the fact. Okay? Good god man. Your making this harder that it really is. At the time, I just assumed he was sitting there. I didn't know he was doing a thing.

[maddog]

Freen has made a valid point from the start of this topic no-one knew 3 & 7 was freen until he let it be known so when he did attack arty he could well of been a noob user so the way arty reacted could be deemed excessive. However in artys defence the private msgs arty received from 3 & 7 could also indicate that the player wasnt a noob but a vet player at prommis so i can understand why arty reacted like he did so in a sense freen brought artys attack upon himself cause of the pms which a noob user wouldnt of sent.

[The Beatles]

irregardless

regardless

But moving right along, I still don't quite get the situation. Is it the case that you were attacking Arty, he logged on during those attacks, and hit you back? That's slightly unkind, perhaps, but nothing really unjustifiable. I know I've done it myself in wars (although not for just land grabs).

Is it the case that he attacked other people while you were running? That I see nothing wrong with.

[windhound]

It seems pretty straightforward that if one person is running, it would make sense not to disrupt them/start running because that way you split the land available, resulting in a less than par run for both.

...but you cant get mad at someone for running at the same time can you?

I think that it's understood that if you get distracted long enough to be marked offline, when someone else comes on, they're not at all at fault for attacking you, considering you were marked offline.

Er. Everyone is still marked as offline every ten min correct?
So if I've really got to go to the pooper and I leave at 1 min before turns reset and return 5 min later, then say I spend 3 min looking at people to hit, espies and such, its alright for other people to hit me because I spent 4 min marked offline? And its not alright for me to continue my run, just because another player started their run in the 4 min I was on the toilet?
That's the general consensus I've gathered... please correct if I'm wrong

Customs /do/ take a while to figure out
I've had a chat with several players who didnt understand why people were irritated at them, or why some things were acceptable and other things less so

There used to be customs in war
But then again, with players like Shadow maxing people because they can, there's probably not much difference between war and normal play... other than online attacking becomes slightly more common

[Arthus]

Is it the case that he attacked other people while you were running?

Yes Beatles, that is the case. I didn't attack him till he attacked me first. This being the second time. I standard attacked back, I wasn't in a particularly happy mood to begin with, and this being the guy who sent me annoying threats and onlined me previously, I hit him hard, sue me. I'm human, I get mad. Most n00bs aren't evem half as annoying as Freen was so if he was testing things out like he stated, what a dumb way to do it, no offence. I met and helped alot of new players out at ME, none, not a single one ever start off with threats and then onlining.

Whatever, if Freen wants a war with his reason for doing it being that, go right ahead.